Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

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marty11
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by marty11 » Wed, 04 Dec 2013, 22:29

5 cents worth of power from a school, owner plugged in while watching his son play sport. .someone must have "dobbed " him in.. then...

link stole Electricity 5 Cents = Jail

interesting - over the top... but it pays to ask , wherever you are.. no permission, equals stealing..

Woudl you plug in without permission.. Cos it is "there"

Is that like picking up money off a table that isnt yours? Or is it "ok"
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g4qber
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by g4qber » Wed, 04 Dec 2013, 22:42

Could phone users be next?

Perhaps the power points need to be locked up

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Adverse Effects » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 01:32

so when i plug my phone in to a clients computer to charge it when i am working on it i could be sent to jail?
for 20 min of 100ma 5V what dose that add up to be

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Gabz » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 01:52

g4qber wrote: Perhaps the power points need to be locked up

I hate this argument.... it's like saying that you left your car unlocked so I within my rights to steal it.

can take your Christmas lights off your lawn because you didn't lock them down ?

edit: it this case yes the police officer had a chip on his should and cared more than the owner of the power point. I would say that he got some attitude from the EV driver.
Last edited by Gabz on Wed, 04 Dec 2013, 14:55, edited 1 time in total.

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by g4qber » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 02:03

I put a lock on my yazaki charge coupler in public.

One of the reasons I don't like the volt EVSE and the ECS-20 cos they use the delta charge coupler (cc)
The delta cc doesn't have a lock hole.
The clipper creek EVSE used to have a yazaki cc

And e-station's 32 amp box needs a cable padlock

When I stole power at the osborne park good guys, I was told to f off.
The funny thing is that that store already had some bad customer service reports.

Cannington good guys store the young guy from customer service said go for it.

Mandurah good guys store has padlocks on their 10 amp sockets.
Last edited by g4qber on Wed, 04 Dec 2013, 15:10, edited 1 time in total.

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by jonescg » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 02:16

A publicly accessible power point in a public space, like a soccer field or a school, was placed there to provide a public convenience to someone who wanted a bit of power, and without the need to ask permission.

If the same power point was hanging off a business or private residence and permission was not sought, then the owner should have apologised and disconnected. But because it was in a space where someone might reasonably want to take advantage of such a public convenience, then why the hell not?

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Gabz » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 02:33

I'm going have to disagree and the only reason why most of them aren't secured is because until the EV came out, a portable device that sucks 10amps and for hours. it wasn't worth the cost in securing them.

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by poprock » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 03:05

In Oz it would fall under an obscure law called " theft by finding ". We are obligated to return the item found or to ask permission to use it.As Scrooge said : "bah, humbug " Image

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by g4qber » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 03:11

http://m.green.autoblog.com/2010/02/15/ ... what-isnt/

I think I might be becoming a liarwyer in their jaguars. Mispelling intentional.
We have fancy cars and charge where we can.

That could be how we get the fancy car in the first place. By getting freebies where we can.
Eg saw an alleged lawyer in a jag on a mobile.
We are above the law.

http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthre ... ling/page2
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by offgridQLD » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 03:38

The outlets in parks and public places are usually just for the council workers or grounds person to plug power tools and things like that into. Or perhaps to power a function/event that would have permission to use the outlet. Not for charging your EV. Some one has to pay the bill its not a charity for the EV owners personal benefit.

How would you like it if some one came to your house and sucked 10 or 20kwh from your outlet at 25c kwh perhaps more?

Ask permission and offer to pay. If your not getting permission from the person who pays the bills or some one who has authority over that person then you don't have permission and it is a crime.

A Ev can consume $4 - 5 worth of electricity peek rates if you fully charged it. Try getting away with filling up your ice car with $5 of fuel from the pump without paying and no penalty if your busted. Even 50 cents of fuel from the pump it's a crime. The fuel pumps are not locked.

I would never do it its not worth it.

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Last edited by offgridQLD on Wed, 04 Dec 2013, 16:47, edited 1 time in total.

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Adverse Effects » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 05:32

offgridQLD wrote: The fuel pumps are not locked.


no there not but try getting anything out of them till the attendant turns it on

oww and if the gas station is closed i bet they are locked
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by acmotor » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 05:44

jonescg wrote: A publicly accessible power point in a public space, like a soccer field or a school, was placed there to provide a public convenience to someone who wanted a bit of power, and without the need to ask permission.
....


Chris, that is simply not true. Please change your thinking. Image

Kurt is on the money. Ask someone who actually has the authority to approve is the correct proceedure. Finding that person is not always easy. If you can't then don't.

Some (many) places have no EV charging policy and set hurdles. Just jump over them as required. Test and tag, manager, head of school, cleaner etc.

The last thing we need is bad rep for EVs because of energy theft.
Actually, I've yet to get a knock back. If you go about it the right way it seems everyone has a soft spot for EVs. Image (at this stage at least, unless EV Energy theft becomes common)
My local council president (for shire permission), the monks at the local monastry, the local coffee shop etc. all come on board.

Take the time to do the EV info sell. I even entertain the local sparky who could see the point that I wasn't taking energy away, just pushing the electrons throught the primary side of the charger transformer so kinda not theft like stealing petrol ! Image He chuckled the whole time while he added a 15A circuit to the breakout board he was setting up at the local show for me since the shire president had given me the nod.

If you do get caught out doing the wrong thing, have the right attitude. If you don't know what that is then don't plug in. Image
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by jonescg » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 06:05

Actually the text you have quoted me on is exactly true. That's why it was installed right? If not, they wouldn't have installed the GPO in a semi-remote location (i.e. good chance no-one is around to ask permission) the first place. Things like radios, satay stick cookers, maybe a portable lamp for the barbeque - these were no doubt the intended appliances, and it's likely that the council ranger doesn't expect a visit each time someone wants to take advantage of said convenience.

What is up for debate is whether or not you plug your >2 kW charger into it, and moreover, do you even really need the power? I'm in agreement though - seek permission wherever possible, and only charge if you absolutely need it. If it's just a luxury charge and you really don't need it to get to your next destination, you're just being greedy.

What did our PM say the other day? Better to do and seek forgiveness or something...?
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by acmotor » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 06:39

Ok, job for you.
Obtain in writing a statement by say Stirling City Council that any power outlet in a public park can be used unconditionally for Electric vehicle charging. (10A, 15A single or 20/32A 3 phase included for clarity)
It would be good. Put it up on the AEVA web site. Image
Then get letters from the 47 (is it) other shire/city councils in Perth.
Then get someone in the east to start on their shires.

If you can't get it then we shouldn't suggest theft.

When it comes to theft, forgiveness is a bit late. Image
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Adverse Effects » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 06:41

ok so riddle me this

if you put a BIG copper coil under the HV 22Kv lines you can get power out of it

since i am not touching any hardware of someone else am i stealing anything and if so who from

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Adverse Effects » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 06:46

acmotor wrote:When it comes to theft, forgiveness is a bit late. Image


that is not how it is for politicians and there "travel allowance clams" here in Oz

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by acmotor » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 07:12

Adverse Effects wrote: ok so riddle me this

if you put a BIG copper coil under the HV 22Kv lines you can get power out of it

since i am not touching any hardware of someone else am i stealing anything and if so who from


You obviously haven't tried it then. All you will get is a bill for $7,000 a tonne for the copper. The magnetic field is so weak and invariably cancelled by the 3 phases at 120 degrees and a coil on the ground is not what you need for coupling since the 22kV lines do not form a primary. (capacitive coupling would be a better move, or a physically large tuned LC circuit close to your local HF radio tower)

I do get your point though. If you can get power (well, energy) without actually plugging in then what is the legality ?
Well PVs give power without plugging in and the sun's energy is free... for now. Image
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Adverse Effects » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 07:26

it dose work

i use to go camping with a mate (army) and he had this unit he would lay on the ground under power-lines (about 70cm across 300cm long 2cm thick dark green rubbery type of thing) and would run about 8 lights off it and the only time they turned off is when unplugged or when he rolled the unit up

i dont know where he got it but he had a LOT of army gear so *shrug*

but yes the point was / is what about isolated induction power generation / creation / what ever lol
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by jonescg » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 15:54

acmotor wrote: Ok, job for you.
Obtain in writing a statement by say Stirling City Council that any power outlet in a public park can be used unconditionally for Electric vehicle charging. (10A, 15A single or 20/32A 3 phase included for clarity)
It would be good. Put it up on the AEVA web site. Image
Then get letters from the 47 (is it) other shire/city councils in Perth.
Then get someone in the east to start on their shires.

If you can't get it then we shouldn't suggest theft.

When it comes to theft, forgiveness is a bit late. Image


I don't mind doing that - it would clear up a few things. As for the 47 other councils, it might just be better to get a confirmation letter from WALGA on behalf of all councils.
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by offgridQLD » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 15:59

Even though I expressed my view before. I will say that being sent to jail over the 5c of electricity even though it is a crime was to harsh. A stern warning or perhaps some community work to give back to facility he stole the power from even just a small fine is for fitting for the crime.

If he then went end did it again then up the penalty.

Kurt

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Gabz » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 17:30

http://smh.drive.com.au/motor-news/man- ... 2yrut.html

The Australian media have picked up the story gotten comments from coworkers already.

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by acmotor » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 17:46

Adverse Effects wrote: it dose work

i use to go camping with a mate (army) and he had this unit he would lay on the ground under power-lines (about 70cm across 300cm long 2cm thick dark green rubbery type of thing) and would run about 8 lights off it and the only time they turned off is when unplugged or when he rolled the unit up

i dont know where he got it but he had a LOT of army gear so *shrug*

but yes the point was / is what about isolated induction power generation / creation / what ever lol


So what army section was he from. inteligence ? Image or deceptive propaganda. Image
Was it a SWER line ? I hope they were LED lights. Image
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Adverse Effects » Thu, 05 Dec 2013, 21:19

acmotor wrote:So what army section was he from. inteligence ? Image or deceptive propaganda. Image
Was it a SWER line ? I hope they were LED lights. Image


as far as i know (never asked) just regular army and we camped out west of charleville qld and it was 25+ years ago

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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by marty11 » Fri, 06 Dec 2013, 20:50

UPDATE !

There are always 2 sides to a story.. seems the man was "known to the school" and also had a run - in with the police officer when approached.. run in being argumentative, then called for a documented report to be issued , in light of representations to the police attending, by the driver of the EV.

new link.. 2 nd sideof the story followup reveals more

Still gets you thinking about "getting permission first though"

All of this could have been avoided so easily, dont you think?
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Leaf owner Stole Power got Arrested Jailed

Post by Gabz » Fri, 06 Dec 2013, 21:12

it's odd he had to go through the car to determine who owned it ?

having the ability to apologize properly gets you out of a lot of trouble

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