Mitsubishi Electric Car lands in Australia

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Who42
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Post by Who42 »

AT last a straight mass produced plugin car that you can charge at home no silly contracts or swapping batteries packs that tie you to a another commercial operator. I would just like to see Power outlets in parking bays and shopping centers like they have in England Image

Mitsubishi i-MiEV – Mitsubishi Electric Car lands in Australia
Today marked the arrival of the first mass-produced electric cars in Australia. The two Mitsubishi i-MiEV electric vehicles landed into the Port of Brisbane to a warm welcome from the media and gave Mitsubishi the crown of the first manufacturer to bring a ready-to-sell electric car down under. Image

Some interesting facts about the i-MiEV is its 160km range per charge, which takes 7 hours on a normal household plug. Once the “fast-charge” infestracture is available here you can charge the car to 80% capacity in just 30 minutes. It can travel at up to 130km/h using three different modes: Drive, Eco and Brake.The battery in the i-MiEVs is a 16 kilowatt hour LiIon PO4 which waighs about 200kg . If you’re unfamiliar with what a kilowatt hour is: a household heater rated at 1000 watts (1 kilowatt), left on for one hour uses one kilowatt hour (equivalent to 3,600 kilojoules) of energy.The i-MiEV and its battery should last at least 10 years if not more. The battery pack is separated into 22 modules each carrying four batteries 88 cells in total at 330v and there has been no battery failure to date. Image

The car is powered by a single electric BLDC Permenent magnet 47kw motor that drives the rear wheels. Power is put from the engine into a reduction gear and then through a differential. Mr Sanders said most first time drivers are surprised at its acceleration, as the Electric i-MiEV can accelerate faster than its petrol equivalent.
The fast-charge system currently used in Japan is a result of the Japanese manufacturers agreeing on one set of standards for charging electric vehicles and with charging stations being available in populated areas. Australia is still in the process of examining needs for electric vehicle standards. Image


A 3kW solar array on a house which can produce 17kilowatt hours of energy per day that will easily recharge the i-MiEV from empty to full, meaning there is absolutely no emissions generated when the car is charged.
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Last edited by Who42 on Mon, 03 May 2010, 16:41, edited 1 time in total.

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Er..Sorry, but exactly what is the purpose of your post?

I mean, what's different new? Or were you trying to make a point about press releases?

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Post by Who42 »

marcopolo wrote: Er..Sorry, but exactly what is the purpose of your post?

I mean, what's different new? Or were you trying to make a point about press releases?


Image I thought some people might like some facts about Mitsubishi-i-MiEV it should be avalible in June and I think its great news I did not see any other posts with any specs Image

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Post by evric »

Available - at what price?
Prius Plug-in Conversion: http://www.evplus.com.au ...Holden Barina EV: http://www.evric.kestar.com.au

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Post by Who42 »

evric wrote: Available - at what price?
Image

I was told between $45 to $60 thousand dollars Image

But it looks as if it will be closer to $60 thousand dollars because the Federal Gov won't give any incentives and no word from the State Gov yet Image

Lets hope Mitsubishi price it to compete with the Toyota Camry Hybrid at around $45 thousand dollars Image then I would buy one Image
But like most new things they will charge as much as the market will bare Image Hopefully with competition from the Holden Volt and Nissan Leif later this year prices will come down even Blade Gets EV conversion will offer some competition at $41 thousand dollars Image
Last edited by Who42 on Tue, 04 May 2010, 05:21, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Digger11 »

$45,000 for a tiny little "Mr Maggoo" mobile. You are kidding us right ???
You can nearly buy a new Mercedes for that price - totally outrageous.

Like all of these rip-off's they will only be bought by the trusted soles we give our taxes and council rate payments to. Very few of us who work for our money will waste it on this little toy car.

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Post by antiscab »

hahaha yep you can buy a new mercedes for that price, but not run it (the last one i saw cost ~$3500 for a new starter motor).

Who42 wrote: The battery pack is separated into 22 modules each carrying four batteries 88 cells in total at 330v and there has been no battery failure to date.


Thats a little worrying.
Not having one fail means they haven't tested for failure modes.
I do hope thats something the marketing/PR guys dreamt up.

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Post by marcopolo »

Who42 wrote:
marcopolo wrote: Er..Sorry, but exactly what is the purpose of your post?

I mean, what's different new? Or were you trying to make a point about press releases?


Image I thought some people might like some facts about Mitsubishi-i-MiEV it should be avalible in June and I think its great news I did not see any other posts with any specs Image


Well, there is the "i-MIEV in Brisbane" By mcudogs, 12 March 2010" and a great many others.   

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Post by Who42 »

marcopolo wrote:
Who42 wrote:
marcopolo wrote: Er..Sorry, but exactly what is the purpose of your post?

I mean, what's different new? Or were you trying to make a point about press releases?


Image I thought some people might like some facts about Mitsubishi-i-MiEV it should be avalible in June and I think its great news I did not see any other posts with any specs Image


Well, there is the "i-MIEV in Brisbane" By mcudogs, 12 March 2010" and a great many others.   


Well I did a serch of this whole forum and I did not see any other posts with any specs or facts about Mitsubishi-i-MiEV Image
Last edited by Who42 on Wed, 05 May 2010, 00:15, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by acmotor »

Nice summary post Who42. Image

I never tire of promotion of the world's first mass production EV.
I just wish the mass production would ramp up as it looks like Oz will
still wait another year or so to get imiev on the showroom floor. Image
They are only making 8000 this year for the whole world and Oz is not high on the priority list... despite being the world's worst per capita CO2 emitters.

I drove the imiev in Perth today at the mitusbishi show off.
Very driveable ! Very responsive ! Sooooo smoooth !
The price ? $60k ? That's the price of the latest whiz bang toy !
They could still sell plenty here... if only they could get hold of stock !
Yes, it is small and different looking, but rather civilized for an urban commuter.

The rear wheel drive returns the tight turning circles that front wheel drives with their drive shaft/CVs spoilt. Only the traction control limited the fun. Regen braking was great ... just like red suzi ! Image

If this is the future of small urban commuters then bring it on !
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Post by Who42 »

Hyundai i45 hybrid
In May the i45 will arrive in Australia, one of three new Hyundai models being launched here in 2010.” said Oliver Mann, Hyundai Motor Company Australia’s Marketing Director.

“Already breaking records in South Korea and receiving awards in the US, i45 is certain to make a big impact in the competitive mid-sized segment.”
As a part of Hyundai’s global eco-friendly strategy ‘Blue Drive’, the i45 will incorporate a full parallel hybrid drive system that can operate via an electric motor, through its advanced Atkinson cycle 2.4-litre four-cylinder petrol engine or a combination of the pair depending on driving conditions and driver demands.

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Hyundai i45 hybrid & turbo announced Image
Image[
“In May the i45 will arrive in Australia, one of three new Hyundai models being launched here in 2010.” said Oliver Mann, Hyundai Motor Company Australia’s Marketing Director.
Image
“Already breaking records in South Korea and receiving awards in the US, i45 is certain to make a big impact in the competitive mid-sized segment.”Image

As a part of Hyundai’s global eco-friendly strategy ‘Blue Drive’, the i45 will incorporate a full parallel hybrid drive system that can operate via an electric motor, through its advanced Atkinson cycle 2.4-litre four-cylinder petrol engine or a combination of the pair depending on driving conditions and driver demands.

Hyundai says its proprietary full parallel architecture differs from the power split technology (series hybrid) used by most competitors, allowing significant efficiency advantages. The i45 is also set to benefit from high-efficiency lithium polymer batteries which are both lighter and more compact than existing nickel-metal hydride and lithium-ion units.Image

The Hyundai i45 Hybrid will also utilise an efficient and compact six-speed automatic (not a continuously variable transmission like many other hybrids) coupled with a modified hybrid starter-generator to eliminate the need for a torque converter. The system allows more efficient use of the electric motor’s power, allowing it to be driven at higher speeds than its competitors in EV-only mode at highway speeds.

Hyundai predict highway fuel consumption figures of 6.03L/100km and a city cycle figure of just 6.36L/100km.
Image

Hyundai i45 ‘Blue Drive’ Hybrid key components:

■A 30kW electric motor delivering 205Nm of torque
■A regenerative braking system
■An integrated starter generator that enables the engine to turn off at stops and restart automatically under acceleration & electric only mode
■A lithium polymer battery package, with 50.3 Ah of capacity at 270 volt
■A Theta II 2.4-litre petrol engine
■Six-speed automatic transmission with electric oil pump
■Weight-efficient bodyshell with a low drag coefficient (Cd 0.25)
■Electric air conditioning compressor
■Hybrid power control unit
Last edited by Who42 on Wed, 12 May 2010, 21:00, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by rhills »

ACMotor, how'd you find out about the iMiev show in Perth? Was it only today? I registered interest in the iMiev on Mitsubishi's website ages ago, do you think they'd have contacted me to tell me about this? How badly do they want to sell them?

I bet if it was a Pajero, a Magna or a Colt, they'd be all over me like a rash.

Anyway, was the "show off" only today or can I rush up there tomorrow? If so, where do I rush to?
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Post by acmotor »

Well that is the problem that Mitsi have at present. No stock to offer.
It is the old marketing nightmare for the Oz dealership.
There would be no point in wide promotion if there is no product to sell ! There isn't even a waiting list to go on !

To be candid, the presentation was not for believers and the already EV informed. In fact without even being able to say how many imiev would come to Oz, at what price, when, and for sale or lease, exactly who customers would be (other than probably govt/fleet) then it was frustrating other than the hands on with the EV.
We were told the detail would come soon !

I did point out to the VC of mitsi strategy that the web site 'interest' has no follow up. I had gone down that path as well as approached dealers to no avail.
There seems to be concern by mitsi that the Oz govt is cold on green and has not come up with the incentives and support for EVs that the EU for instance has. My reply was that mistsi should concentrate on building the actual EVs and not placing demands on or 'directing' governments. Money went to hybrid camry because there was no other clear offer at the time IMHO.
The world will move to cater for EVs, more so when we have product on the roads.
There was argument that infrastructure need to be in place. Delay tactics and political shuffling me thinks.

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Post by marcopolo »

acmotor wrote: Well that is the problem that Mitsi have at present. No stock to offer.It is the old marketing nightmare for the Oz dealership.There would be no point in wide promotion if there is no product to sell ! There isn't even a waiting list to go on !
Strange, I thought you said you would buy one!
To be candid, the presentation was not for believers and the already EV informed. In fact without even being able to say how many imiev would come to Oz, at what price, when, and for sale or lease, exactly who customers would be (other than probably govt/fleet) then it was frustrating other than the hands on with the EV.We were told the detail would come soon !.
The Mitsubishi representative probably concluded (accurately)that you were just a tire kicker!

I have also driven the iMev at a presentation to fleet owners and although a tad more sophisticated, could not see any real difference between the iMev and Blade Electron except for frighteningly high insurance premiums. The iMev does have ESC, but for a vehicle unlikely to ever exceed 110 kph, that seems of limited advantage.

Mitsubishi, probably concluded, since the worlds first, on sale, mass produced EV, the Australia manufactured Blade Electron, has been totally ignored in the Australian market, (even by EV adherents), that Australia is not a priority market.   

In the budget just delivered by the Rudderless government, the pre-election "green Car' promises have been forgotten. Why would any manufacturer give priority to launching, a new production EV, into such an unreceptive market as Australia?

AC, Digger11, may be proved correct! It is possible there is only very limited appeal for expensive, low range, small EV's in Australia.

Without being unfair to you, and I admire your passion, but I think you have limited experience or understanding of the marketing Automobiles in Australia. Blade, Vectrix, etc..all tried with early production EV's. Although in Vectrix case the product had it's defects, it still found a small number of passionate supporters, but not enough to sustain viability.

Naturally, the first EV manufacturers will concentrate on fleet sales as a priority. In fleet, the person buying the vehicle, isn't going to be the driver, so the purchasing paradigm is very different!

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Post by rhills »

My concern is that MMAC keep talking about "gauging interest" but don't actually seem to have any mechanism in place to do that. I'd have thought the easiest gauge for them to implement would be a contact form on the iMiev site and a waiting list.

If an enthusiast (relatively web-savvy) like me has difficulty notifying them that I'm interested, how can Joe Public? If they have a "demo day" here in Perth and don't even notify people who've previously expressed an interest, let alone publicise it, how exactly are they "gauging interest"?
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Post by rhills »

marcopolo wrote:
acmotor wrote: Well that is the problem that Mitsi have at present. No stock to offer.It is the old marketing nightmare for the Oz dealership.There would be no point in wide promotion if there is no product to sell ! There isn't even a waiting list to go on !
Strange, I thought you said you would buy one!
Marcopolo, are you sure you're not with the Auto industry, or perhaps the Petroleum industry? You seem to display the same warped logic as people in those industries do.

How can ACMotor, or any of us, buy an iMiev when (watch my lips) there is no stock for us to buy, there is no pre-order available, THERE IS NOT EVEN A WAITING LIST YOU CAN PUT YOUR NAME ON!

If all MMAC can do is show glimpses of the vehicle to a small, selected audience, how can they expect anything but a bit of "tyre kicking" as you call it?

I'm no marketer, but this all looks much more like anti-marketing to me Image

For the record, if Mitsubishi were selling the iMiev in Perth today, I'd be lining up to buy it. I can afford to pay the 60K they're supposedly going to ask for it and even though I believe it's an unjustifiably outrageous price, I'd pay it if I had to.
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Post by marcopolo »

rhills wrote: How can ACMotor, or any of us, buy an iMiev when (watch my lips) there is no stock for us to buy, there is no pre-order available, THERE IS NOT EVEN A WAITING LIST YOU CAN PUT YOUR NAME ON!


You are quite right, these kind of promotions are not really serious about measuring sales response. The are about publicity dealer and brand awareness. It is absolutely intentional NOT to have a waiting list. In that way the PR people can report the reaction in any manner they wish. An added bonus is a huge number of the public will react favourably, until they are asked to put down a deposit!

For the record, if Mitsubishi were selling the iMiev in Perth today, I'd be lining up to buy it. I can afford to pay the 60K they're supposedly going to ask for it and even though I believe it's an unjustifiably outrageous price, I'd pay it if I had to.


I'm curious, why would pay more than $60k for a iMev when you have , for the last 3 years been able to buy the equivalent vehicle(and in some ways better), from an Australian manufacturer,Blade Electron for 30% cheaper?

Incidentally, NO, I am not part of the Petroleum Industry! I do have experience in the Auto Industry, and I am a fleet owner, and operator. In this capacity I have been an early supporter of EV vehicles and was briefly interested in Biodiesel.

Just disliking inaccuracy and rabid conspiracy theories doesn't make me a oil company employee!

IN my previous post to AC motor I made an important typo;

Originally posted by marcopolo wrote:
Originally posted by acmotor

Well that is the problem that Mitsi have at present. No stock to offer.It is the old marketing nightmare for the Oz dealership.There would be no point in wide promotion if there is no product to sell ! There isn't even a waiting list to go on !

"Strange, I thought you said you would buy one! "


That should have read, "Strange, I thought you said you WOUNDN'T buy one!

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Post by acmotor »

marco,
The blade runner is hardly in the same boat as the imiev !!!
( That is not meant as a criticism of the blade )
You lose cred for even suggesting.

FYI I carried a cheque with me and would have bought, deposited or even put my name down, but you are not listening. None of the above was offered.
In 6 or 12 months I may no longer be interested.
My choice, not yours !

I have often commented that automakers/marketers don't know their market as well as they think they do. I take your comments as proof of that !

Fleet buyers ??? what a waste of a good vehicle ! Image

My opinion. And worth equally as much as yours. Image
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Post by acmotor »

Some pics....
If you've seen it all before then tough !

Image


Image


Image


Image


Image


Image
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Post by a4x4kiwi »

Nice, Here is the manufacture of the motor and drive
http://www.meidensha.co.jp/epages/prod/prod-02-02.html

edit. picture at the bottom of the page.
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Post by Thalass »

The gearbox (reduction drive, I assume) and motor combo there looks great! And to think, it won't get much dirtier than that! haha

I'll drive an electric vehicle one day.

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Post by marcopolo »

acmotor wrote: marco, The blade runner is hardly in the same boat as the imiev !!You lose cred for even suggesting.


Really? Well the iMev is a newer design,(to Australia anyway)But in reality it's based on the Colt.

In practice the iMev is not that much superior to the BEVE.
The ranges are similar. BEVE (100+klm (200 with a 1hour charge-up)to iMev's claimed 138klm). Both cars carry the same number occupants. The maximum speeds are similar.(Both cars travel at the maximum speed limit!) iMev is a little more powerful. Handling, braking and safety are similar. Charging times (here the BEVE has a 25% advantage) Cost to run is similar. Insurance (BEVE is more economical). Warranty is similar, (BEVE longer, but iMev all in one). Cost of replacement parts (BEVE approx 30% cheaper). Cost to charge is similar, although BEVE is more economical to operate.

What else? Well, that leaves looks, (subjective). Brand recognition appeal, and Japan vs Korea. All matters of personal choice!

Price! Well no one,not even Mitsubishi Australia, can tell you the exact on road price of an iMev. However, most informed speculation is between $60-70000. This is a very significant difference in price in favour of BEVE.

If you set aside the styish, recognition factor, in what way can the iMev justify the considerable price difference against the more humble BEVE?
     
FYI I carried a cheque with me and would have bought, deposited or even put my name down, but you are not listening. None of the above was offered. In 6 or 12 months I may no longer be interested.
My choice, not yours !
Goodness me, now I don't want to misunderstand you, so lets get this right! Are you saying that if the Mitsubitshi salesman had offered you a price of, lets say, $64000 on the road, you would have written him a cheque for that sum, and taken delivery? I am impressed !!!

Or maybe, as you said, you would have just procrastinated until you can buy a second-hand iMev, a bit cheaper?

So maybe automakers/marketers do know their market as well as they think they do after all!?

I still think that you should take the time to revisit the Gen4 Blade Electron. You may, like me be very surprised at what a great little vehicle Australia has produced.

I know the styling isn't futuristic and it doesn't have the instant recognition factor. It won't impress everyone to the same extent, but, is that really so very important?




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Post by acmotor »

Yep, $64,000 and I'd have driven it away.
So much for you thinking you understand the market ! Image

You can buy the e getz. In fact buy a whole fleet of them. Ross would be delighted. You've convinced yourself of how great they are already !
I'm still ROFL at your comments ! Image
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Post by marcopolo »

acmotor wrote: Yep, $64,000 and I'd have driven it away.
So much for you thinking you understand the market.


Oh, did I mention the other advantage of the BLADE? Oh yeah, you can actually buy one!

$64,000 eh, for an iMev? 'course that's easy to say, especially when you can't actually buy one!

But seriously, and I ask respectfully, why would you spend all that extra money on the iMev over the Australian, (well, as Australian as any Australian made car)?

What about the iMev appeals to you?

(Apart from a snobbish antipathy toward the humble Getz.)

What am I missing in my analysis of the two models? Or is your choice simply emotive? I would be interested in your analysis, technical or practical of the two vehicles?

Incidentally, After speaking to Mitsubishi, they admitted that the 144klm range was 'only indicative' in the Australian context, and may vary by as much as 35%. The factors they cited were, heavier passenger loads, heat (ambient), driving styles, road conditions, and 'dirty power'!

The legal disclaimer was pretty comprehensive!

It will be interesting to see the report by Fleet Management Services, of the 4 EV contenders.     


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